Another cried “but we haven’t finished discussing the merits of dual-candidature and strategies for overcoming the inherent ignorance of the general populace!”

At that moment the man known as DD strode over and said with a weary sigh, “we did our best, the Shire is quiet today but I do not know whether we have done enough to defeat Gordon Sauron. We really could have done with you guys by our side.”

High overhead, like a harpy’s cry, could be heard a Crested Commentariat, chirruping “I Told You So”

The arguement against standing another anti 42 day candidate ought to be obvious. The bigger the vote that DD gets on this issue, the better the headlines the following day. It is in our interests for the profile to be raised as high as it possibly can be, and that will come through publicity. Splitting the anti 42 day vote between two candidates is not a clever strategy if you want to maximise the effect that this can have on the publics’ understanding of the importance of civil liberties. Which, I would suggest is what our objective should be.

Although, to be honest, I think a ‘New Statesman’ candidate would get derisory figures as I suspect they would be seen, by the electorate, as a carpetbagger.

Or, indeed, you could stand yourself Martin!

Alternatively, we can discuss the actual realities of what is going to happen this by-election and what its likely consequences will be.

If there is one thing that I miss less about Britain than its New Labour government it is the utter hopelessness of the liberal-left when they are being pushed into having to make a hard decision. No wonder you were such a collective disaster before the invasion of Iraq.

Why doesn’t or won’t the NS campaign for Labour to put up a candidate?

I disagree with Lee that suggesting Davis is not the man to support is diverting the debate against 42 days for the reason raised above - it’s Davis who is preventing it being a single-issue campaign by standing as the Conservative candidate and by promising to remain a Conservative MP taking the party whip.

On the other hand I also think it doesn’t really make any difference what the liberal-left do so perhaps we are wasting our time.

Btw is it true that the deposit is stil only £500? It’d be really easy to fund that - are there ohter stipulations.

And in the process become the party that tried to capitalise against a man with principles on a single issue, branching out into subjects that were never intended to be the issue being debated, and worst of all diverting the debate AWAY from 42 days and towards what it means to be liberal in the politisphere. It would be absolutely moronic, I’m still amazed people can’t see that.

I got my only happiness from the subject to know that my usually loyal MP, Doug Naysmith, stood with his principles after being unswayed by the arguments and voted against his own party. Now if people like him were able to find their principles (and by people like him, I mean those that aren’t generally critical of the government, like some are in the party that DID vote for 42 days), I can’t believe that there aren’t minds to be swayed. It will only take the Tories to reign in Widdecombe (if that’s even possible) and for 4 Labour MPs to change their minds in a liberal direction. Each vote swap counts for two remember, that’s how small a margin we’re talking about.

I honestly believe that if this campaign is as strong as we believe it is, the task of swinging 5 Labour MPs back on to the side of reason and reality shouldn’t be beyond its scope. The positives we have are we should now have a really good idea who the “weakest” 5-10 MPs on the Labour side are on this front, who literally only did it to save the government. They agree with us, they just need persuading that the public is not going to reward the Labour party for their loyalty in this instance.

The recent MORI poll (I’ve not checked how leading it is) says 51% of Labour voters from 2005 are less likely to vote labour…this is AFTER they passed 42 days. The DD campaign can highlight how much of a controversial issue this is to people, especially if media coverage is retained. I absolutely fail to agree with those that have said the chance has gone and that Labour MPs will be even more entrenched come the second vote. Labour already look split, they only won a vote thanks to the DUP, there is no reason for those that wanted to rebel but didn’t to sit behind their government on this issue any more because their party *lost* in the commons. Sticking to their guns isn’t going to change anything for the better, they’ll only be abandoning their principles AND sitting with a dying government.

Con 23, LD 17, Lab 6, Other (right-wing) 2.

If there is no Labour candidate there can’t be an anti-government swing.

It is when the by-election is being fought solely on a liberal issue, left and right don’t come in to it.

“This factionalising is something the liberal \ left have done time and time again”

It’s not creating factions when you’re putting someone with left wing politics up against a right wing candidate in a by-election. David Davis does not represent liberal views and he will be voting on all issues in parliament, not just this one. Having said that this is also a conservative safe seat which has been forced into a mid-term by-election when there is a Labour government in power. There is absolutely no hope that a liberal candidate is going to win and it would be potential political suicide to stand if you had any hope to be taken seriously in politics in the future. Just because the media want it to be David Davis’ single issue campaign doesn’t mean it will be that campaign in the constituency. We are not actually talking about a referendum.

most of us are probably appalled at Tabo Mbeki’s unwillingness to be seen to be criticising a fellow “freedom fighter” such as Mugabe but surely there comes a time when the right thing to do transcends political affiliation.

Firstly let me declare I have always voted Liberal or labour and would never vote Conservative in a General Election, and other than being energised into action by David Davis’s actions, I have absolutely no connection with him or any political organisation

My points, if I may:

Why are people asking for a left-ish person who also disagrees with 42 days to stand against DD ??

Surely the best situation is someone, right or left, who explicitly puts forward their case FOR 42 days and then we can see this more of a litmus test of public opinion. I am so frustrated that some people want to keep broadening this by-election out to a general range of issues. Save it for the General Election, it’s only 2 years away at most.

To those who say Oooh, *shudder* I could never vote for a Tory. On this occasion a man who happens to be a conservative has taken a stand about something we all feel strongly is slipping away from us. If I were drowning, should I would refuse to share the lifeboat with a Tory?

And while we are at it can we nail this thing about DD being anti-gay. His best political mate Iain Dale seems to address DD’s current thinking:

http://iaindale.blogspot.com/2008/06/david-davis-and-gay-rights.html

@ Mike Killingworth, with respect I also feel you are wrong to think the media (definitely will not) and the public (probably will not) will aggregate the votes cast for two anti-42 days candidates.

@ redpesto, I would have said it is not an either-or situation.

Conor is correct to point out the need to maximise the actual number of votes cast, be they for or against DD. The commentariat and politicians will use any excuse to dismiss the validity of the result and a poor turnout will help them The polticos have lost face on this one, their thoughtful, considered and cerebral pronouncements have been shot down in flames by the subsequent deluge of comments left online so rather than admit maybe they haven’t a clue about the real zeitgeist they wait to say We Told You So if DD’s numbers are less than stellar.

With “friends” like The Independent’s Steve Richards:

http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/steve-richards/steve-richards-dont-be-fooled-ndash-these-heroic-campaigns-only-make-our-democracy-even-more-fragile-848514.html

we plebs are on our own on this one so we ALL must play our part.

Please, please, everyone who believes that DD is right to take this action but who cannot physically be at the contest, contribute to what will be a very expensive campaign to get the message across to all the electorate of Haltemprice & Howden and to get them to vote in numbers.

Please dip into your pockets:

http://www.daviddavisforfreedom.com/index.cfm?fa=contentGeneric.hgyetdllezszmndu